Until recently, I had never listened to The Joe Rogan Experience—one of the world’s most popular podcasts, hosted by American comedian Joe Rogan, who interviews an extensive variety of guests at length. I had also never heard of one of Rogan’s recent guests, Christian apologist Wesley Huff. Despite my unfamiliarity with both, I nevertheless decided to listen to all three hours of their conversation (admittedly with a few breaks).
Their discussion was wide-ranging, covering everything from Mesopotamian mathematical conventions to physics and cosmology, but I want here to reflect on one key issue that emerged at the very end of the episode: the distinction between a moralistic view of Christ and the worship of him, especially in our evangelism.
Who do you say I am?
In the episode’s final minutes, Huff seizes the opportunity to ask Rogan, who appears very open to exploring the Christian faith, the all-important evangelistic question: “What do you think of the historical Jesus?”1
Rogan responds by contemplating two different views: 1) the moralistic view, which sees Jesus (or the concept of him) as an archetype to emulate, and 2) the divine view, which sees Jesus as the Son of God and saviour.
Rogan’s distinction of these views is helpful. While it’s true that the New Testament consistently teaches that we are to be like Jesus, it also teaches that we can never achieve the moral perfection that is God’s alone (Eph 5:1; 1 John 2:6; Rom 3:23; Eph 2:8-9). This is, after all, why Jesus came in the first place—to save us from our sins.
Not only that, but a moralistic view prioritises the idea of Jesus over the person of Jesus; reducing Christ to a philosophical concept and ignoring his own exclusive claims about who he was and why he came.
The consequences can be dire, just as Huff outlines in his response to Rogan:
“If Jesus is nothing but a moral example, then you can save yourself and you don’t actually need a saviour.”2
“[Moralism] actually misses what I think Jesus said about what his purpose was, in that you can’t do enough to actually live up to the standard that God holds you to. And so if you keep striving you’re actually going to wear yourself out.”3
Huff is right: not only can a moral view of Christ distract people from actually responding to him, it can obscure the reality that Jesus is our only hope—not simply our example.
More than moralism
I began reflecting on the state of my own personal evangelism. I soon realised that a moralistic view of Jesus can sometimes subtly slip into conversation, unnoticed and unchallenged. Almost like a siren-song, I can become so excited that my exploring friend is talking about Jesus at all that I plunge headfirst into a sea of ambiguity.
I can, at times, fall victim to the mentality that ‘any publicity is good publicity’—that any mention of Jesus is a net positive regardless of what is being said. Yet, when I fail to gently challenge ideas like ‘Jesus was simply a great moral teacher’, I become like the proverbial dog lying beneath the evangelistic table, content with whatever crumbs fall beneath.
I suspect that many of us have found ourselves in a similar predicament, not wanting to scare away our friends with the particulars of who Jesus actually is and the radical things he actually has to say.
And while much of this stems from good intentions, we cannot become stuck in a lukewarm, concept of Christ that does not make sense of his own exclusive claims. Jesus is not simply an example to be aspired to. He is not simply the pattern for human flourishing.
He is the Lord.
I am reminded of this oft-quoted extract from Mere Christianity:
“Either this man was, and is, the Son of God: or else a madman or something worse […] let us not come with any patronizing nonsense about his being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us.”4
The conversation between Huff and Rogan demonstrates that it’s possible to have a respectful conversation about Jesus without compromising the truth of his own claims. If only we would get up from underneath the table, our exploring friends might just surprise us with their willingness to consider Christ on his own terms.
Urgency lost
I remember fondly the first time I read the story of Philip and the Ethiopian in Acts 8. It’s the fast-paced account of when Philip, prompted by the Holy Spirit, tells an Ethiopian official “the good news about Jesus” (v 35). In the very next verse, the Ethiopian sees some water and says, “What can stand in the way of me being baptised?”
That’s some speedy and effective evangelism.
Yes, it’s true that the response is ultimately God’s work (both in Philip’s day and in ours). But that’s not an excuse to hold back from sharing the stark yet saving truth that Jesus is Lord. We simply don’t have the luxury of allowing our unbelieving friends and family to endlessly ponder the concept of Christ without being given the opportunity to entrust themselves to him.
Evangelism is an urgent cause, yet we so often behave as if we have all the time in the world.
Let’s not waste any opportunity. Ask. Clarify. Listen. Share.
Jesus is alive and he is coming back soon.